Car insurance scheme

[exdos]

Do others think that it might be worthwhile looking into the possibility of this group attempting to set up a "special" relationship with an Insurance agency/broker/provider for the insurance of our MCs so that we might obtain cheaper car insurance?

I've set up a poll, and I'd be grateful if you would answer "Yes" if you are potentially interested in this idea.

[woodmeister]

Anything that drives down premiums has to get the thumbs up... :)

[LordeRyall]

Think the outcome of this vote will be obvious!!

Good idea though. I wonder if they'll hold any value to the fact that we are 'enthusiasts' therefore more likely to look after our cars???

[gsi]

The recently set up s2k uk owners club has got a deal with Admiral - so they're certain open to these schemes, but from what I've heard the 'discount' that has been given to the club is fairly easy to get just be haggling..

Be interesting to see what they can offer though :) Just let me get a before quote before getting one with the dicount applied.

[steve1]

Exdos,
Splendid idea, the only drawback I can see is that the age gap of the owners of these cars is enormous, and while some ins companies would welcome the more mature of us ( in age that is ) with open arms, they would probably turn their noses up at the younger owners.
But if anyone can sort it, I,m sure that you are just the man.

Steve.

[exdos]

LordeRyall,

You are right! In truth, I'm essentially looking to see how many members might be interested, so in hindsight ,I could have set up tthe poll just as a counter with just one option.

I can see that some of the younger MC owners might not benefit but I suspect that the over 30's amongst us could well benefit. I'm going to post a similar thread on the Zroadster.net forum to gauge a response. The bigger the potential business for someone, the better the terms we might get.

[Lee]

hey guys I have just noticed this.

I was talking to a customer of mine today about this, they are starting a new insurance company, you will see the tv ads

I have just sold them a call centre and they will be up and running really soon.

anyways they will be offereing some really cool stuff as a differentiation from standard insurers.

the good thing is I am talking to the directors instead of a broker/salesperson

I certainly intended to get myself a bargain but if enough of you are interested I will put the extra effort in.

regards

Lee

[jam]

I would be interested in this, but as you say, you may have problems with the age gap. As I'm only a youngster. :oops:

[sonu_anand]

Lee

is the call centre here or oversees?

['MC' MarkC]

...although you might find that with a reasonably sized group buy, they might be willing to give preferential terms as well as prices, as with the group buy on the warranty. So for example, instead of a normal minimum age of 30 for group 20+ cars, they would offer the same to 25yrs+ :?:
This is a great idea. It's so obvious. Everybody has to buy it each year, unlike wheels, steering wheels etc. I'm amazed nobody has come up with it before. How easily we overlook what is staring us in the face.

I think I've got a pretty good deal with my current insurers, but will be most interested to see what kind of deal Lee and/or Exdos can get. 8) 8)

[BEN]

What about if your 21!

[Don]

Great idea... I imagine that if our 'group' i proven to have lower claims, points etc. than the 'average' driver then we could get a decent discount. I'd guess this may prove be the case as 'entusiasts' tend to look after stuff a bit better!

[exdos]

What about if your 21!

I'm sorry to say that I think your recent interaction with the BiB might exclude you from car insurance of any sort for a period of time :?

Obviously, when I approach an outfit with the proposal, I will attempt to be as inclusive for as many MC and Z3 owners as possible, but obviously, the preferrential terms/cover/premiums that I'll try to get will have to be tailored to suit the majority if some sort of deal can be finalised. At the end of the day, some individuals will always remain "high-risk" in the eyes of the insurers, and the preferrential rates that I'll be looking for would also need to exclude "high-risk" drivers if it is not to adversely affect the terms offered to an otherwise "low-risk" group of owners. What I will try to emphasise in negotiating is the need to make a distinction between the inherent risk of high-value performance cars and their low-risk owners, with an emphasis more on insuring the owner rather than weighting the car.

[Broccers]

For info : Liverpool Victoria cover you when a dealer loans you a car. My own BMW garage provide a car free for warranty work but for anything else you have to insure the car yourself.

[Lee]

Sonu

It is located in the uk

2 sites

[ZZZEMMCO]

Any reduction in premiums --but NOT benifits, is a good thing.One needs to go through offers, with a fine toothed comb, to try to compare like for like. How are their Claims dept services, if needed ??.

15 Insurance companies offer quotes for BMW Car Club members, from Aon to Heritage, Footman James to Carole Nash-- All have differing idea,s for cover, Heritage include circuit cover for better driving days and offer an extra 10% off for IAM members.

From time to time one reads of companies refusing a claim on a technicality, so its worth getting feedback from policyholders , when deciding on a possible offer.

[Don]

Sonu

It is located in the uk

2 sites

...good to hear, makes a change compared to most of what you read in the press about call-centres these days!

[Lee]

Sonu

It is located in the uk

2 sites

...good to hear, makes a change compared to most of what you read in the press about call-centres these days!

I think places like India will be the graveyard of call centres in the future

the bubble has popped on that one I think.... and hope for my sake

[Shunt]

You think oversea call centres are bad, all control software for United Utilities is currently being written 'Offshore' (India) and being commissioned by a team from India over here. And you think call centres have a communication problem!! :? :? :? :?

[sonu_anand]

Indeed, out sourcing is a sorry thing, but alas I think the software industry in this country has a mere 10 years left. I hope that I am wrong!

[clivem]

If outsourcing allows companies that follow it to have a lower cost base then that enables them to offer lower prices. I don't think anyone could say that the car insurance industry is not competitive in that respect. If you want to pay more for UK call centres then it's your choice to pick an insurance company that suits. Is it more complicated than that?

[Lee]

fine in principle but do the companies setting up call centres abroad pass on these savings??

I cant see any evidence in the market

[exdos]

I've posted a similar thread on the Z4um forum, and someone posted this:

Below is a list produced by the Association of British Insurers of some of the typical modifications.

Alarms/immobilisers/tracking devices
Alloy wheels
Badges indicating increased performance
Blueprinting
Body kit
Bonnet bulge
Bored-out engine
Bull bars
Car phones
Chipping - engine management system change
Crash bars
Dashboard changes
Decals/stickers
Driving lights
Dual controls
Engine casing changes
Exhaust system changes
Flared wheelarches
Flared wings
Fog lamps
Front spoiler/airdam
Gearing change
Hand controls
High level brake light
Larger speakers
Locking wheel nuts
Miscellaneous engine alterations
Murals
Nitrous oxide kit fitted
Non standard paint work
Non-standard engine
Non-standard re-spray
Radiator bars
Rally lights
Rear roof spoiler
Rear spoiler/aerofoil
Rear valance
Replacement seats
Side skirts/sills
Slick tyres
Sports steering wheel
Spot lights
Standard engine replacement
Steering change
Stripes
Sunroof
Supercharging
Suspension changes
Tail lift
Towbar
Transmission changes
Trial tyres
Turbocharging
Upholstery changes
Uprated brakes
Uprated stereo systems
Wheel trims
Wider tyres
Wider wheels

Have they missed anything that they can charge extra for :?:

If you say your car is worth £X,000 iincluding the cost of the mods you've fitted, then surely the insurers reach the premium to charge based on the value to be paid out on the full pay-out in the event of a claim.

I would agree that certain "performance enhancing" mods appearing in that list, such as fitting Turbos or Nitrous Oxide kit should attract a higher premium, but surely brake and suspension upgrades are safety mods and locking wheel nuts and trackers are anti-theft measures.

[Don]

I would agree that certain "performance enhancing" mods appearing in that list, such as fitting Turbos or Nitrous Oxide kit should attract a higher premium, but surely brake and suspension upgrades are safety mods and locking wheel nuts and trackers are anti-theft measures.

I think it is more a case of getting more money out of people :( . Insurers could argue a suspension mod could allow you to go faster not necessarily safer, also 'safety mods' fitted aftermarket (non-factory) and not done properly (even locking wheel nuts) could make your car more of a liability :shock: .

Also, be aware that premiums are often calculated on the basic car value PLUS extras/mods but many insurers will only pay out for a basic car in event of total loss... check the small print!

Good effort on this group buy idea, seems like about 30 folk interested!

[exdos]

Also, be aware that premiums are often calculated on the basic car value PLUS extras/mods but many insurers will only pay out for a basic car in event of total loss... check the small print!

Good effort on this group buy idea, seems like about 30 folk interested!

So far the numbers showing interest are:
Z3mcoupe.com 30
zroadster.net 23
z4um.com 8
I think that on those figures, the idea has merit and I'm sure that if the idea materialises into reality, then more owners would at least obtain quotes from the "Z partner" insurer, prior to renewing their annual insurance. Of course, the idea will only materialise and be a success for both ourselves and the insurer if the insurance meets several essential criteria, including:
1. Competitive rates
2. No-nonsense terms and conditions with no stupid exclusions and Catch 22 clauses.
3. Realistic view towards modifications without swingeing increases in premiums for mods.
4. Excellent claims handling and service.
5. Possibility of extensions to include track days with prior notice by the owner.
6. All repair work under insurance to be carried out at BMW delerships or owner's choice of repairer.

If anybody would like to add to this list then please feel free to list other parameters that we should seek to include in any scheme that we set up. Once I know what everyone wants from their insurer, I am then in a position to try and fix up our requirements with an accomodating insurer who wants our business. It's my intention to restrict this insurance to BMW Z variants only.

It would also be useful if people could give me simple details of their present insurance, giving details of:
Age, Age and Value of MC, Number of Years NCB, Recent claims, Location and if garaged overnight. Penalty points on licence, XS and Annual Premium. If you'd like to send me these details by PM I will, of course respect confidentiality. If I have a selection of cases to compare with what might be offered, it would give me more negotiating power.

[Lee]

if quotes from which ever company you choose are competitive for the majority then maybe post dated contracts would swing a good discount??

obviously the contracts would be void if before the start date a customer had crashed 6 times!

[exdos]

Lee,

Excellent idea :!: Keep 'em coming :idea:

[exdos]

I've just made contact with Adrian Flux Insurance http://www.adrianflux.co.uk and discussed the possibility of Z3 insurance with Craig Darwin, the Underwrighting Manager.

Craig was extremely helpful and was certainly interested in the proposed idea. I told Craig of our requirements:
1. Competitive rates
2. No-nonsense terms and conditions with no stupid exclusions and Catch 22 clauses.
3. Realistic view towards modifications without swingeing increases in premiums for mods.
4. Excellent claims handling and service.
5. Possibility of extensions to include track days with prior notice by the owner.
6. All repair work under insurance to be carried out at BMW delerships or owner's choice of repairer
7. Courtesy car if car off road due to accident/theft.
He felt that the only difficulty that he would have on accomodating everything on this list would be the trackday extension into the appropriate insurance. However, his company could refer you to another insurer for cover if and when trackday cover might be required. He assured me that changing alloy wheels, fitting spoilers etc. would not materially alter the premium and XS, and only mods increasing power output (Turbos and chipping etc.) would materially affect premiums.

In order to discover how competitive Adrian Flux would be, we have agreed to test their quotations against actual existing premiums members of this group are presently paying. I therefore require 5 volunteers who will phone Craig for a quotation to compare. Can I please have 5 volunteers :?: Once I've got the volunteers, I'll give each of them Craig's phone number to try them out.

If Adrian Flux can deliver the goods for us, I also suggested the possibility of Adrian Flux having a "banner" at the top of our webpages (for a fee 8)) which was not dismissed by Craig.

[sonu_anand]

One volunteer.

[Don]

I tried Adrian Flux when I was renewing my insurance last year, they were quoting higher than my current insurer. Happy to try Flux again if you need volunteers.

[exdos]

I've now got my 5 volunteers, between this forum and the zroadster.net forum. I await the result of your quotes with interest.

Below is a copy of the email that I've received after my discussion with Adrian Flux, Hopefully Adrian Flux will want our business and come up with some very competitive quotes.



Dear ........,

Many thanks for contacting us today to discuss to
the problems that you and your fellow Z3 & Z4 Owners
encounter with insurers when making minor modifications
to your vehicles.

As we discussed, if there are Owners looking for
competitive cover we would welcome their Call.
We also welcome younger drivers, convicted drivers and
are able to discount premiums by up to 15% for those of
them that are part of an Owners Club.

I have just spoken to a Supervisor on our Quotes Floor
and he has advised that we have several companies who
will also be able to provide Track Day use as part of
the cover - which I know from our conversation some
of your Forum members require as a necessity.

All of our policies have Free legal expenses cover -
£50K worth of legal fees in the event a member/policyholder
has a non-fault claim.

Although we are able to cover every model in the Z3 & Z4 range,
some of the insurers on the panel we choose from (and are able
to cover Modifications and provide Trackday's) do however impose
a 'Maximum Value' on the vehicles they cover. I understand that
this is £25K with some, although others go up to £35K and for those
that are even more expensive we still have a suitable Underwriter.

If you feel that this is something that will be useful to those
forum members please feel free to post a thread perhaps informing
those members who are not aware of our competitiveness in insuring the
marque.

[bungle]

impose a 'Maximum Value' on the vehicles they cover. I understand that this is £25K with some
yep, I've found this a few times.

One thing that is a real bug-bear for me: I can't find ANYONE that will cover both my cars, ie. my ZM, and another car with mods. No-one will do both - plenty will do either, but either cos of value (>£25k) or mods, no-one will do both. Hence, I end up using my full NCB on one car, and cos I'm using another insurer for the other, they won't mirror the NCB so I have NIL bonus on one of them, so it's blo0dy expensive. So I want someone that will cover BOTH cars :roll:

Track days and ability to cover mods (at a reasonable price) both important to me.

Understand you've got the 5 already, but happy to do it as well if you need it (one of my policies up in 3 weeks).

ps. what's their attitude to points as well? This varies a lot between insurers.

another ps. why does it keep centring (sp?) my text?

[exdos]

I've just had the email below come through from my man at Adrian Flux, if anyone wants to give them a try, please feel free. The more calls they get, the more potential business they will see before their eyes :shock: £$£$£$£$£$ :shock: the more they will realise that it would be worth their while to deliver for us.

Hello again ........,

Just had a chance to have a look on the forums.

Thank you for posting the thread, I have just had
a call from a gentleman with a slightly modified Z4
who had seen it on www.z4um.com.

Could you please, please direct the callers to the
Call Centre - Quotes Floor number 08700 777 888

Please let me know the outcome of the calls.

Kind Regards
Craig Darwin
Adrian Flux Insurance Services

[sonu_anand]

Just tried getting a quote from Adrian Flux but the wait time was appalling, so I hung up :roll:

[exdos]

I'm afraid that the quotes that our members have had back from Adrian Flux have not been better than, or equal to, their present insurance rates, therefore the search for another insurance provider goes on.

It's my intention to write a letter to a few of the direct providers with whom several of us are presently insured to see if we can get more realistic attitude to mods etc.

I'll report back when I get a response.

[sonu_anand]

Good stuff exdos. Try Elaphent as I've got the best from them. Others are Liverpool and Victoria, ESure, Tesco, NU.

[gsi]

Frizzell & Priviledge are the cheapest I've had quotes from. Tesco and Elephant were ok, but their terms were not great and only cheap for year 1.

[Don]

Frizzell & Priviledge are the cheapest I've had quotes from. Tesco and Elephant were ok, but their terms were not great and only cheap for year 1.

Hi Rob, for elephant you need to go back as a new customer every year, i.e. don't take the renewal quote, get a new quote online (the online quote will be cheaper by 5-10%) and ask them to renew you at the online quote... worked for me over the last 4 years.

Am interested in what you mean when you say that the terms are not good? I have always been curious how elephant are soooo cheap for me compared to everyone else. I could not find anything obvious in the terms? To be safe i got GAP insurance anyway so i will get what i paid for the car in the event of total loss.

[maahny]

with regards to elephant...my e30 m3 was a total loss last year and they paid out very quickly and their service was excellent even though they did not value my car as much as it should have been worth. Gap insurance or pre agreed value is a very good idea. My coupe is also insured with them.

[gsi]

Frizzell & Priviledge are the cheapest I've had quotes from. Tesco and Elephant were ok, but their terms were not great and only cheap for year 1.

Hi Rob, for elephant you need to go back as a new customer every year, i.e. don't take the renewal quote, get a new quote online (the online quote will be cheaper by 5-10%) and ask them to renew you at the online quote... worked for me over the last 4 years.

Am interested in what you mean when you say that the terms are not good? I have always been curious how elephant are soooo cheap for me compared to everyone else. I could not find anything obvious in the terms? To be safe i got GAP insurance anyway so i will get what i paid for the car in the event of total loss.

When I looked into it, which admittedly was a while ago, things like a crap car only for a few days whilst yours was being repaired, no unlimited mileage, no taking into account company car NCB.. I probably could have got a better deal with them if I had persisted, but I found Tesco cheaper at the time - albeit with some similar 'iffy' terms. Sorry can't be more specific but it was a while back. Perhaps they're better now they're a bit more mature as a business?

[LordeRyall]

I have used Elephant for the last 2 renewals now and I found their terms at least as comprehensive as their competitors if not more so. I haven't enquired about track day cover admittedly so they may fall down on this if it is a priority for some.

[bungle]

I haven't enquired about track day cover admittedly so they may fall down on this if it is a priority for some.I've asked, and it's a categoric "no".

[sonu_anand]

Don

top tip, I've saved myself ~ 150 quid by redoing my Elephant renewal online!

[kieron]

also i found tesco insurance very cheap, cheaper for me than elephant, thats why i changed.

[Don]

Sonu, Have you got a second driver (female) on your elephant insurnace too.... this saved me 20% :shock: :? :shock: .

I heard elephant are especially good if you live in a city or are young. Couple of my mates were on elephant and when they moved out of town/city to small villages they found other insurers more competative (but not by much).

[Chris H]

It still astounds me the extent of the difference in premiums between insurers. Having phoned round a few for my potential (and hopefully not too long now) purchase, I found Elephant the cheapest at c£800. Compare this with my current insurers (Footman James) who quoted me in excess of £2k!! I too had put my girlfriend down as 2nd driver with elephant, so sounds like there are actually benefits by allowing your missus to drive your car.... :lol: ...until she prangs it...

[sonu_anand]

Don, yep. Have the car insured in the Mrs name! Paying ~400 notes not bad :D

[Don]

Don, yep. Have the car insured in the Mrs name! Paying ~400 notes not bad :D

£400 is not bad indeed, i'm about double that :(. Anyway it's a good idea but check the small print if you use the ZMC to commute, second drivers are normally NOT covered for commuting (i'm not exactly sure of elephant's position on this). It's fine unless you have a bash in rush hour and they ask you where you work :shock: , catches out a lot of young drivers who get their parents to insure the car and add themselves as named drivers to save a few £££.

[davieb]

I've been with Tesco for a number of years and found them to be excellent, however just had the renewal in and decided to shop around. Sainsburys was about the same, Elephant a bit cheaper, but found Highway (direct and via First Direct bank) and got a quote £100 below Tesco, for what I perceive to be equivalent cover. Incidentally thought I'd try BMW Insurance - they don't even have an MC on the list of models!

[exdos]

If you've done any mods, try Adrian Flux. I discussed this scheme with Flux when I first started this thread and when my insurance was up for renewal in January this year I saved £200 from what DirectLine wanted after I'd done a few mods.
With Adrian Flux, the cost of my mods are also covered on a like-for-like basis, whereas many insurers might insure a moddded car but won't insure the cost of replacements of modded parts so they charge you for something and provide no insurance - outrageous.

[Trundler]

I have to agree - Adrian Flux were cheaper than most, if not all, of the others I had tried, though they did have my car down incorrectly (as an M3 Evo) to begin with!!

[martlet]

…Incidentally thought I'd try BMW Insurance - they don't even have an MC on the list of models!My Coupé is still insured with BMW Insurance, but will switch when due in September: I have already switched the wife's 323 Insurance, purely because I was annoyed with the (unreasonable IMHO) increase in the Warranty coverage.

[dalecan]

Bell was cheaper than Adrian Flux for me.

[biggusladdus]

FYI e36coupe.com have a deal going with Adrian Flux.

I have an e36 328sport, witha couple of mods, and have just used Adrian Flux to renew.

I was with Admiral last year paying ~ £800
Turned 25 during the policy and renewal quote was £688. Then I told them about the three points I picked up in March and they wanted £930!!!!! (3 yrs no claims, no accidents or other convictions, good postcode)

Called Adrian Flux to see what they could do, and they came back with £588. All mods covered like for like as well (admiral will only replace with standard parts).

[BEN]

adrian flux wont insure me!
im to young! pah!

[exdos]

adrian flux wont insure me!
im to young! pah!
Ben,

Cheaper car insurance is the only advantage I know of getting older. you can't have everything all at once :!: :cry:

[j1muv]

adrian flux wont insure me!
im to young! pah!

Ben

I'm with Bell and a year younger than you (I think) so give them a try.

Jimbo

[BenH]

Just to add that as a relative youngster at 27, elephant have been cheapest for me last 2 years running. Confused.com is a useful way of comparing major insurers quotes without filling in loads of online forms, gives you piece of mind that you're getting "the cheapest" quote.

[BEN]

everytime i use confused it says elephant is not working, same for tesco, and a couple of others!

bell worked out more money too

this is why you should'nt let the police catch you!!!!!

me without a ban!

£1114.00

me with a ban

£2318.35

[Greenbat]

Was ther an outcome to this poll? Insurance is due soon

Greenbat

[exdos]

The e36coupe.com forum have recently organised a group scheme with Adrian Flux:

http://www.e36coupe.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=68047

I have no idea whether they or us started this thread first, but provided you can get cheapr insurance then that's all that bothers me. 8)